Superman Returns with Dustin Chafin
Veteran comic Dustin Chafin joins Movie Wars for a brutally honest—and hysterically funny—breakdown of Bryan Singer’s Superman Returns. With James Gunn’s reboot looming, this episode unpacks one of the most polarizing chapters in superhero cinema, complete with stalker Superman, real estate villainy, bad wigs, and even worse writing.
Dustin Chafin, a powerhouse stand-up with credits on HBO’s Crashing, Showtime’s Comedy Showcase, and a brand-new Dry Bar special, brings his razor-sharp comedic instincts to the pod. Chafin, who tours nationally with Nate Bargatze, doesn’t hold back as he rips into the film’s odd tonal shifts, misplaced camp, and the absolute madness of casting Kevin Spacey as Lex Luthor.
The crew debates Superman’s stalker behavior, dives into the “cursed energy” of the cast and crew, and shares behind-the-scenes trivia—including how Brandon Routh got the part by accidentally (or not?) spilling coffee on Bryan Singer. Dustin’s hot takes on superhero culture, childhood nostalgia, and why “kids ruin superhero movies” make this one of the most unfiltered, entertaining Movie Wars episodes yet.
Takeaways:
- Dustin Chafin shares his complex love-hate relationship with superhero films and nostalgia.
- We break down what Superman Returns tried to do—and why it misfired hard.
- Kevin Spacey’s Lex Luthor gets roasted for being soulless, unfunny, and utterly baffling.
- Parker Posey shines, but the rest of the supporting cast feels like filler.
- We debate whether Superman should even have a kid—and why that subplot made zero sense.
- Casting "what-ifs" include Josh Hartnett, Ashton Kutcher, Brendan Fraser, and Jim Caviezel (denied for being too Jesus).
🎧 Show Notes & Timestamps:
00:00 – Intro & Dustin’s bio: HBO, Showtime, Dry Bar, and touring with Nate Bargatze
01:54 – Dustin’s superhero fatigue: “I always root for the villain”
03:37 – Superman Returns’ canceled cast: Spacey & Singer
05:50 – Why DC animation doesn’t hit like it used to
08:10 – James Gunn’s DC reboot & Cavill controversy
10:02 – The absurdity of Superman’s disguise: “It’s just glasses, dude.”
13:02 – Hair talk: Superman’s magical mid-transformation swoop
17:00 – Cavill vs Routh: Natural gains vs padded suits
20:00 – Superman Returns = “Stalker Man”?
21:30 – Kevin Spacey’s Lex Luthor: no jokes, no soul
24:00 – Dead dogs and cringey tone shifts
26:00 – “Kids ruin superhero movies” hot take
28:30 – That awkward child subplot and the piano scene
30:00 – Superman’s weekend dad sketch idea: “He breaks the skee-ball machine!”
33:00 – Audition facts: Josh Hartnett, Cavill, Ashton Kutcher, and coffee spills
37:00 – Jim Caviezel denied for being “too Jesus” after Passion of the Christ
41:20 – Kate Bosworth’s weird IMDb arc
42:30 – Why Margot Kidder’s imperfect Lois Lane worked
- 44:00 – Wrap-up & roast of the real estate plotline
Transcript
Foreign.
Kyle:Ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the Movie wars podcast. We're doing it digital today.
Seth:I'm Kyle. I'm Seth.
Kyle:And we have an amazing guest with us today. Texas born, New York City raised comedian. He's had appearances on HBO's Crashing, Showtime's comedy Showcase.
He just released an amazing new dry bar comedy special, Google Dry Bar. You'll find his comedy special there.
He's actually touring with Nate Brazzi as we speak, and he's got two albums on serious radio as we speak as well. He's got some tour dates we'll talk about at the end of the show. Mr. Dustin Chaffin, ladies and gentlemen. What's up, dude?
Dustin:Hey. What's up, guys? Wow.
Seth:Good to have you.
Dustin:The intro, it's. Happy to be here. This is awesome. I love it.
Kyle:Yeah, man.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:So stoked and. Yeah, man, it's. You're. You're here. You're taking a little break from tour and you stopped by to hang out with the Movie wars crew.
Highly appreciative. Welcome.
Dustin:Yeah, it's exciting. I love talking movies. That's all we do in green rooms anyway, you know what I mean?
Like, might as well take it to a podcast, you know, I feel like most of our podcasts are just stuff we talk about with comedians all the time.
Kyle:Yeah. And there is this weird Chris Farley show temptation when writing bits.
Remember Chris Farley show on SNL where all he's doing when he's interviewing people is, remember when you did this in that movie? And like, there are. There's a weird temptation to do that with writing bits. Like, start off with the.
With a bit like, hey, did you guys see this scene?
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:You know, have you ever heard of garbage cans?
Kyle:It's not a good way to start, but. So what is your.
Seth:Oh, yeah, you go ahead, Kyle.
Kyle:We were talking before. So you love movies. What's your experience with Superman? Superheroes? Do you like it? Do you not? What do you. What do you think about the whole thing?
Dustin:Wow. You know, it's. You know, I'm a little older than you guys, so I've gone down the road of superhero movies over the years, and I feel like they.
They kind of came back and were great, and then they were. They stopped being good again. And then now it's like, I'm not quite sure where we are with all of it. Yeah.
But, yeah, I mean, I remember how big a deal it was when Batman came out. The. You know, the first one, and it was like, you know, we had never really seen much of that kind of stuff in the theater.
And so it was a big deal and we were all excited and like, oh, man, this is, you know, this is going to be crazy. Tim Burton, like, Nicholson, like, this is. And so that excitement as a kid, you know, that was pretty cool and remembering that stuff and.
But, yeah, it's like, I don't know, man. I think I'm kind of burned out.
It was interesting watching the film that we chose today, because I feel like maybe it put a little spark back, but I don't know, it's. But I, I, I. The idea of a superhero is. Is always kind of a good thing for me.
Of course, I'm always rooting for the villain, which seems to be what's wrong with me. I'm always like, I can always see the villain's point of view. Okay. And I see. I feel like the superhero thing, it's just like, all right, dude.
You know, it's like, yeah, you got a lot of good points. But then, you know, you.
I feel like the, the villain always went through a little more, and so that's that, like, so I'm kind of mixed and all over the place.
Seth:But, yeah, this particular movie, it was very hard to root for Kevin Spacey, both as Kevin Spacey and with the plan that he had as Lex Luthor. Like, oh, my big plan. I'm gonna create a new continent.
Kyle:Real estate.
Dustin:He ended up on an island that's pretty popular these days.
Kyle:Yeah, Yeah. A lot of island talk these days.
Dustin:You're like, I don't know about that island you got there. Kevin. And then Brian Singer, he's also like, in the news of all that crazy.
So was a hard, you know, like, just far as a canceled culture kind of thing. It was, it was interesting. Like, they had a double whammy in it. Yeah.
Kyle:Cancel Culture Island.
Dustin:Yeah, there you go. That's what it was.
Kyle:Yeah. No, it's. And you're so right. Like, my kids and Seth and I have been talking about this when we're not recording, but I have been get.
Taking my kids through the Batman animated series from the early 90s, which is just so good.
Seth:So good.
Kyle:Even. Even as an adult. But what. I've been like Catwoman. Like, every time Catwoman comes on screen, my daughter ask every time.
She's eight, she's like, is Catwoman good or bad? I'm like, she's both.
Seth:Question.
Kyle:That's why she's amazing. And I find myself, I tell them all the time, the reason Batman is so good is because the villains are so good.
Dustin:Oh, yeah, absolutely. It's like. Yeah, it's a different one every movie. And that's. I had a little problem with this. It's interesting with the. With the animated stuff.
I want to love all that animated stuff that's coming. I really like the death. The death of Superman, all the Batman series. I can't get into the animation.
That's why, like, I thought Spawn looked amazing when they did on hbo. Like, that animation looked great. I don't like the DC animation, man. I can't get into it.
It's just like, yeah, stories are great, the voiceovers are amazing, but I just can't. The way it looks, I just can't do it.
Seth:I definitely noticed because I, for the first time, earlier this year, went through Batman, the Animated Series, and Superman. The Animated Series and the ultimate old ones, like from the 90s. Those ones look really good.
But every time I've tried to look at one of the modern ones, there's just something strange about the style that I just don't like.
Dustin:Yeah. It's just that, I don't know, Asian chop shop animation, like, it just doesn't. I don't know, it's a little soulless. I don't like it.
Kyle:Yeah, I think one thing that. Go ahead.
Dustin:No, I was just gonna say. Well, I feel like, you know, I grew up with Disney. Those things look amazing.
You know, like all the Disney films and they painted the thing and, you know, Heavy Metal is an amazing. You know, that film looked great. Like, I don't know, I'm just. I'm kind of a snob with animation. Like Ralph Back Backy and all that stuff.
Like, I want, you know, I wanted to.
Seth:Did you see Disney recently announced they're actually returning to traditional 2D animation?
Dustin:Yeah. Yeah. I, you know, I'm pretty excited about that. Yeah. I don't love the Pixar thing. I love the movies themselves. The stories are phenomenal.
But after a while it's like. Yeah, I do miss the painted. I went to art school, so I'm a little. I like art and painting.
Seth:Okay, cool.
Dustin:I just think it should. I don't know, just. It flows better when it's like drawn animation. I just love it. Yeah. And like.
Kyle:Yeah. I think one thing that's really interesting for me at the Batman Animated Series is that. Yeah. The animation. You're right.
At the same time, like Kevin Conroy, his voice.
Dustin:Yeah, it's great. It is. But sometimes I just. You know what I mean? We just have a hard time. Losing yourself in Something just because you're just like.
It doesn't draw you in. I don't know. Did you guys see the Spawn animated on hbo? It's the greatest thing you'll ever see.
It's beautiful and it's R rated, so it's just fantastic. I mean, the movie was the worst thing that's ever happened, you know, but far as that, they made it too early. I feel like the CGI wasn't ready.
And it's interesting. We'll talk about the movie we picked today. But. But, yeah, but the Animated Series was great. Except for Todd McFarland or whatever.
He would just, you know, talk too much before the series, before the. The episode. So you'd have to hear him talk about how great he is. You get to the actual episode, it's really great. But, yeah, definitely.
Check that out.
Seth:The greatest animator that's ever existed. It's a great time.
Dustin:Exactly. Tremendous. Exact. That's what it feels like. And you're just like, what are you doing?
Just let us watch, you know, Spawn, like, chain somebody to a wall, you know? But, yeah, but that's one of my Spawn.
Kyle:Spawn. The comics were so violent and visceral and, like, they somehow ruined it with that movie.
Dustin:Yeah, it was. I mean, part of it was good. I like that actor. He's cool. But it just. I don't know, it just, like, once it got to the hell scenes, it was just.
Like I said, they just didn't quite have the animation. I don't know when that came out exactly. I think it was maybe before Superman. Right? I think maybe before Superman Returns. I'm not sure.
Yeah, feels like it was.
Kyle:Yeah. Well, the reason we're doing this one today is because, speaking of ruining things, James Gunn. James Gunn is dismantling the entire DC universe.
And this is his. Him trying to get a start, a fresh start.
And he started off on the wrong foot when he pissed off all the fans and decided Henry Cavill wasn't going to be in it. And that was a bad start. He's announced basically he's not going to link it to the Batman. So he's just. He's just not making anybody happy.
Dustin:On top of that nerd uproar.
Kyle:Yes.
Seth:The Snyder Bros. Were not pleased.
Dustin:Yeah. This is the new protest.
Kyle:Yeah.
And I learned quickly, like, and I was joking with him before you came on Dust and I, Movie wars had an old version before we rebooted it to this format. And we just never did Superman movies. Right. Like, I'm an Arnold Sly guy.
And then Seth comes on and dives me like month two and just baptizes me in the Snyder verse. And just, just. The Snyder Bros. Were not nice.
Seth:They're vicious.
Kyle:They're vicious, folks. So we've done all those Supermans and now we get to dive into this one. This poor ip though. I'm not a Superman fan.
In fact, I honestly, I cannot stand it. I'll be real. I love Batman, but this one actually. Seth, you're gonna laugh.
I actually contextually, within the world of Superman, was thankful for the Snyderverse. After watching this, I figured it was.
Seth:Gonna be that way.
I think a lot of people, because here's the thing, people watching at home, if you hated the Snyderverse, you have Bryan Singer to blame for this because he tried to do this weird thing where he's like, oh, okay. It's a soft reboot, but also a sequel to the old Superman movies. But somehow only five years later in universe they now have cell phones.
So like, what is going on?
Dustin:Yeah, well, Superman in general bothers me. It's just like, like Kyle, have you ever walked in somewhere with your glasses off and like, who's this guy? Like it.
Kyle:Yes, Seriously.
Dustin:I mean, it's like nobody looks that different with it with the guy. They still stay on path with that. And you're just like, you might.
Seth:That I will say Henry Cavill did an actual test where he wore glasses in the middle of Times Square and no one recognized him as Henry Cavill or Superman with his glasses on. But the moment he took him off and was like, hey, it's Superman real.
Kyle:Because everybody's on PCP down there.
Seth:Yeah, but it's probably not as far fetched as some people think.
Dustin:But your workplace and you, like, you're seeing Superman all the time. Like you guys are doing spreads in the newspaper. You're looking at his face all the time.
You know, they're never like walking in, he's by the coffee machine. It's. You're always seeing that face, dude. You're seeing Superman's face every day. And then you're seeing Clark's face every day.
You're gonna put it together. That's all.
Seth:It's the hair, it's. It's the crappy bowl cut. And then he turns it into the little curly Q in the front. Like that's, that's what's doing it.
Dustin:And that's what I hate about it too. It's always some good looking dude like Nicholas Cage.
The idea of that was exciting to me because he's banged up and so, like, I think you got to be bang. You have to be a little. Not goodlook to care about other humans when you're goodlo.
Seth:Absolutely missed opportunity. That Nicholas Cage movie would have been. Oh, my God.
Dustin:Yeah. I mean, even the Will Smith doesn't seem terrible. Like just something different, you know? I mean, now it seems bad, but at the time like that.
But that. That movie he did was pretty good where he played the superhero. What was that?
Seth:Hancock.
Dustin:Hancock was not. It wasn't bad.
Seth:It wasn't bad.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:And it was right at the time where people weren't fed up with superheroes yet. Like, we.
Dustin:We.
Seth:You know, we'd had the X Men and Spider man, and then Iron Man, I think came out the same year as Hancock and the. The Dark Knight. So it was kind of a big renaissance of. Of superhero characters.
Dustin:Yeah, it was good. But. But. Yeah. All right, you guys, we'll get into this and other notes about this.
Kyle:Yeah, that's actually a great segue into the questions. The hair thing. My first question was about this. It's. This is one thing I've never. And it's the worst here, the hair. This is the worst hair.
Worst Superman hair.
Seth:Well, I think James Gunn is about to fix that with the broccoli head haircut that Clark has in the new one.
Kyle:Let's go ahead and just downvote that new one. It's going to be bad news. Well, I'm just gonna.
Dustin:Hilarious. Superman has their hair plugs. How's this happening?
Seth:I love all the pictures from the Nick Cage times because he had long hair. Like, they were gonna do it where he had long hair.
Dustin:Which. Yeah. Just fun. Just fun. Yeah. The idea is different.
Kyle:Well, I mean, especially in this Nick Cage renaissance.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Yeah. And I guess it comes from the, you know, I guess the time that it was, you know, when was it what we talked about the 30s. When.
When did this comic book come out? Like, what's.
Seth:Yeah, I think 30s, 40s, somewhere around there.
Dustin:19. Think everybody kind of had that peaky blinders kind of perfect hair. And like, you know, we had.
We weren't eating processed food yet, so nobody was bald, you know? Yeah.
Seth:Everyone was smoking packs of cigarettes a week.
Dustin:Yeah. They didn't hurt you because you weren't eating crap. So it was like you could smoke back then. Nobody, you know, it didn't matter.
Kyle:Everyone was Superman back then.
Dustin:Yeah. Everybody look. Everybody looked like. You see those old pictures, though, like, those old videos of, like, the.
In the 20s in Times Square, and everybody. Nobody's Fat. Everybody's got a full head of hair. Like, it's like. So it's a different time. Absolutely.
Kyle:This is what I don't get. And Seth, you bring. You bring the knowledge on this one because you. You're the. You're Snyderverse. And you're very. You're just.
You have more awareness of this ip. Why is it that he can. Yes. He's changing his outfit. He's usually ripping his suit off. He's doing that.
But where in there does it go from this floppy over the eye thing to this perfect, like, where? Why? How? Like, it's just like he's. Is he considering that. I know it's just a very micro thing to focus on, but is he.
Is he thinking of it like, I gotta do my hair? Like, I just wear. In the process of his makeover during.
Seth:The conversion, Dapper Dan pomade with him at all times. So when he's in. Whatever he's doing to change, he's just like, let's flip it back, y'.
Dustin:All. Because.
Seth:Yeah, it is. It is. That is the one thing I especially love about Henry Caval's transition from Superman and Clark Kent is that. Yeah, there's.
His hair is a little messier as Clark Kent, but it's like. It's nothing super drastic. This literally goes from all down in his face in a mid part to a. Swooped over to the side with a perfect little curly Q.
It just. It's too much.
Dustin:Well, I think it's an alien thing. I guess it's like tentacles almost, you.
Seth:Know, like the hair is alive.
Dustin:Well, yeah, I think so. Yeah. It's like he's. He's in alien form, so everything's perfect. Alien just, you know, shape shifts into, like, GQ guy or whatever. I don't know. Yeah.
Seth:Hair is an alien in and of itself named l'.
Dustin:Oreal. Yeah. You know, I don't know.
And I think people are like, you know, I guess the idea of it too, is it's like, you know, a handsome guy is what is who you want to save you. You know, I mean, like, I remember I've, like, tripped and like, a homeless guy tried to help me. I'm like, get off, dude.
Like, but, you know, but it's like a guy that's, like, you know, chiseled and perfect. You're like, as. You know, I think people like to be saved by a dude that's well kept, you know?
Seth:Yeah. But even this version of Superman is not that chiseled. He's quite scrawny. Actually.
Dustin:Oh, this one we're talking about?
Seth:Yeah, yeah, Ralph. Like, I get in the face, he kind of looks like Christopher Reeve still, which fits the weird, like, continuation of the Christopher Reeves universe.
But it's like you look at him versus Henry Cavill. Henry Cavill is actually ripped. This guy is just a dude.
Dustin:Yeah. Seth, is it fair to say that's your man crush?
Seth:Oh, no, Jared Leto is my man crush.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:Although there is a two scenario there. Yeah.
Dustin:But did they. Did they add muscles, though, to his suit, though? Henry Cavill, even though he is ripped. They added. No, he didn't add muscles. You sure? I don't know.
Seth:Fully natural.
Dustin:I thought there was a little bit of, like. Okay. Because that.
Seth:I mean, there might be shaping with the suit, but it wasn't like pads like they would with a lot of other people.
Dustin:Oh, okay. I don't think it was pads. I think it was just kind of like almost like a Batman suit. Just kind of like.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Like, contouring a little bit Contoured. Yeah, it's a little bit.
Seth:I mean, there's one shot of Henry Cavill where he comes out of the ocean with his shirt off, and he is absolutely jacked like that. And we talked about this on the man of Steel podcast. He. He didn't do steroids.
Like, he was completely natural as far as steroids are concerned for that whole situation.
Dustin:Yeah. You know, I mean, call it. They don't call it steroids. Whatever. Yeah. You know what I mean? Whatever the Hollywood version of whatever that is is.
You know, they're on it for sure.
Seth:He was probably on testosterone. But we were. Again, we talked about this. You look at the difference between Henry Cavill as Superman and, like, Hugh Jackman as the Wolverine.
Hugh Jackman is absolutely on steroids. And you can see just because of how unnatural the muscles look when you look at Henry Cavill. He's just a bulky dude and. And he carries it well.
Kyle:Yeah, yeah, he was huge.
Dustin:He's a little older, too. I think when you're older, you gotta, like, all right, dude, just put the. Just put the shot in. Let's do this, you know? Yeah.
Eating green's not gonna do it when you're 38. You know what I mean? Like, he's gotta. Gotta go all in. So I understand it, don't you think? I feel like, though. Like, I feel like you're.
You guys are big fans of the Henry Cavill thing and his Superman inverted, but I felt like it. I feel like it took, like, him doing other movies for us. To appreciate him as Superman. You know what I mean?
Like, I thought he just did such a great job. Ambition impossible. Like, he's done some cool roles over the years, so I feel like he be. We realized how cool he was. He'd be a great bond, whatever.
Like, I just. I think we appreciate him now more and more, and that kind of makes his Superman better.
Because when it came out, not everybody was kind of, like, praising this dude.
Seth:This is true. Yeah.
Dustin:Yeah, it's. But now I think we're like, we. We appreciate him more. We're like, okay, he did great job. He looks great. He's funny.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Like, you know all those things. He's great in action. He could fight. He could literally fight. Like, that's still scenes with.
Seth:He's Cruz. So good as Geralt in the Witcher.
Dustin:Yeah. Yeah. He's like, you know, he's like. We really, really grew on us, I think.
Seth:Yeah. I'm very excited to see his Warhammer show because he's obsessed with Warhammer and he's producing it, so it's gonna.
I think it's gonna really be a love letter for him.
Dustin:Yeah, it'll be great. Yeah. I mean, I like him now, but I didn't then. I wasn't sure when he came out. I was like, who's this dude? Whatever.
Another, you know, crappy Superman. But. But going back, I see where it man is.
Kyle:I think it's because he's actually. He's a huge nerd in real life. He's a video game nerd. And he.
But he looks the way he does, and it's kind of like, gives the hope to us other, like, real nerds. Like, maybe someday I can. Testosterone.
Dustin:Yeah. I like. Yeah. Well, have you ever. Yeah, just like. Like, a hot chick talks about football, you're like, oh, my gosh. You know, like, it's like. Yeah.
Like, when you just hear when that happens, you're just like, what is happening? You're not supposed to talk like this. You're not supposed. That's how it's supposed to be in your brain. So.
Kyle:Yeah, he caught that out of bounds. He caught it.
Seth:Marry me.
Dustin:Hi. The offensive coordinator. Like, what is that? You know?
Kyle:Marry me.
Dustin:Yeah, right.
Kyle:Marry me now.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:The last question I had this is. So in all of my research, this. This was the most common negative feedback I heard. I mean, there was a lot of negative feedback, but this one.
Stalker or Superman or stalker man.
Dustin:Stalker. Yeah.
Kyle:Yeah, absolutely.
Seth:Back to the Christopher Reeves days, because he was definitely kind of a stalker in Those old movies just showing up on people's balconies, looking in people's windows.
Dustin:Yeah. I mean, I. I mean, are we going in on this? What's happening? I don't know.
Seth:Let's go.
Dustin:Yeah, go in. Yeah. Well, what. I. I felt like there's some great scenes in this movie, and there's some. I remember I saw it in the theater and it was. It was such a.
It was another one. A big deal. Superman's back. Let's do this right this time instead of all those horrible sequels with, you know, Christopher Reeve. But it was.
And so, you know, and that first scene is phenomenal. Like, it's like when he. Like, he's saving the space shuttle thing and it lands in the baseball field.
And then he gets out and it's like, you know, the applause, which, you know, I've played a few arenas, and it's like, there's nothing better than that, you know, like all that. So then you're just like, oh. And then you can see it in his face, too.
He's like, yeah, you do it for the applause, you know, like, it's a funny moment where it's like he does it for the love also. It's like there's other reasons for mankind and all that. But, you know, just that scene where it's like, they're so happy he's back. Yeah.
Seth:That's kind of the weird thing about this movie. For me, I was fully. Because this is only the second time I've seen it, and the first time I saw it was maybe two years ago.
And I was fully on board through all of that, right up until Lex Luthor starts revealing what his plan is. And that was the moment where I was like, oh, this is stupid.
Dustin:Yeah, he's terrible in this. This. Yeah, this. Have. This character of. Of Lex Luthor is terrible. I mean, going with Gene Hackman is. Gene Hackman added so many layers to Lex Luthor.
It's. He's hilarious. Kevin Spacey's not funny once. I mean, I don't know when they're trying to be funny. When you, like.
I don't even know where there was a joke. I couldn't find one joke with the Lex Luther. Lex Luthor in the comics. He's supposed to be kind of funny. It's like he's.
He's a madman, but he can land a joke, you know?
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:And you watch under him as Underwood.
And you realize retroactively when you go back through his repertoire before House of Cards, he's been Francis Underwooding, his whole career, just every role, he's just that volume 11, just over the top. It's like, God, that's annoying.
Dustin:Yeah. What was that mean? Bosses or whatever. Bosses. What was that?
Kyle:Boss.
Seth:Horrible bosses.
Dustin:Horrible bosses. Yeah. It's just that. That's all it is, you know, it's like, actually not even as good. He was a little funny in that.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:But I think the writing was better for that. And I don't think they had the. The script finished when they casted everybody on this. I think I was really. Yeah.
Seth:I wouldn't be surprised.
Dustin:Yeah. So I felt like it was kind of, you know, put together, but I don't know, I just. I love the first Superman and I love the second Superman.
The first 1 and 2. I think they're fantastic. And I think, you know, Gene Hackman is such a deep, you know, soulful guy, and so you really like.
Whereas you could tell, knowing what we know about Kevin Spacey, there's definitely not a lot of, you know, soulness there of, you know, heart. And so. Whereas. Whereas you know, Gene Hackman. And then also the thing with. With the. Who's the guy? What's his. His deliverance? What?
That guy's name he played Burt Reynolds. No, the other one.
Kyle:John Voight.
Dustin:Nope. The one that got it Squeal Like a Pig. The third one. Well, he's in Damn it. Superman. I love how, you know, everybody that didn't take it, except.
Except the one guy that took it for the team. You don't know his poor name.
Seth:Yeah, hold on, hold on. Ned. Ned, baby.
Kyle:Yes. It was on the tip of my tongue.
Dustin:So they're like. Like. Like the. The girlfriend or whatever is kind of, you know, not that important.
But the relationship between Ned Beatty and Gene Hackman in those character, the Loose Luke, Lex Luthor and that character are so funny and so bumbling, and he's, like, trying to do stuff and he's doing it wrong and he's yelling at him or whatever. I don't know. I just like that element a lot better than. There just. There was no depth in the. The relationships.
I love Parker Posey, and I thought she was probably the better of. Of the group, you know, the evil group.
Seth:The whole time I was just wondering why Cow Penn was there.
Dustin:Which one is Calpin? The.
Seth:The. The. The Indian guy. Like, why. Why is he there?
Dustin:Oh, yeah, yeah. I don't even remember. That's how unimportant it was to me. I just saw this thing and I can't remember it.
I remember being there and then, what's up with the dog? Stuff like that drove me crazy. Like that one scene with the dogs. He ate the dog. I was like, I'm a big dog guy, and I'm just like, my only memory.
Seth:So I never saw it as a kid, but my dad went and saw it in theaters. I was 12 years old when it came out. And the only thing I remember, when he came home, I was like, so how was it? And he's like, it was terrible.
There's one scene where just like, Lex Luthor comes home and the dog ate the other dog. That was the only thing I knew about this movie for 10, 15 years.
Dustin:I have two little dogs, and I just like. That did not set well with me. Why is. It's not funny. That's not funny. Then they try to call it back at the end, well, I'm gonna eat the dog to live.
And you're just like. It's like, stop with the dog eating stuff. Like, oh, my God.
Kyle:Oddly placed in this film. It's oddly placed here.
Dustin:Lex Luthor sucks. And Kevin Spacey did not do well. He was so cocky in this. And it was like, I don't know.
Seth:Not in the right way.
Dustin:No, not in a Lex Luthor way. Not in a genius, mad genius way. Like, he just, you know, I don't know.
There's a realness to like, even, like, Elon, you know, there's a realness to these mad geniuses that, you know, I don't know, he just did not have. I just. It's just really disappointing because, I don't know, the first one, I thought it was fantastic.
And then the villains in the second movie are off the charts. You know, the three. The three piece. Three piece band. Those guys.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:So good. Yeah.
Kyle:Maybe real estate is the only way that you can get after your enemy. Right, Seth? Maybe. Maybe that's the only way. But unless you listen to Movie Wars.
Seth:Crystals in the ocean.
Kyle:Yeah. You got to send Movie wars to a friend to save. To save the real real estate plan.
Dustin:That's pretty slick. I never seen by do that. That's great. You're talking about my call to action. Yeah. I don't know what you guys are. Yeah, do what you got to do.
I'll try to find something.
Seth:Maybe your plane is connected to a space shuttle and it's not disconnecting and you need. You need to get some. Some positivity in there. Send Movie wars to your friends.
Kyle:Yep. Or just send them Dustin's. His. His dry bar special.
Dustin:Yeah, whatever. It's. Yeah, whatever you need. We're all gonna make you happy at some point, hopefully. There was a couple lines I liked. I did.
Like, I don't want to be a God. I just want to bring fire to the people. That was a pretty. Pretty cool line about destruction, you know, I thought that was poetic a bit.
Seth:Yeah. There were some really good moments. And like, I said that first, like, 45 minutes, I just.
I thought was absolutely so well done getting everything set up. But then it's like they. They just out of nowhere, leaned into all the camp, and it was so weird. It's such a weird tonal shift, like, halfway through.
Dustin:Yeah. And I also think I'm just a bold statement here, if you guys are ready for it, but. You ready? You guys ready? Strap in.
Seth:I'm grabbing the couch.
Dustin:Okay. I think children ruin superhero movies, you know, they ruin them. Iron Man 3, was it or two with the kid?
Seth:Three, three with the kid.
Dustin:Spawn had the kid. I just. I don't know, man. It's like.
Seth:Not Spider Man.
Dustin:Yeah. Yeah. I don't love him as Spider Man. I'm not gonna lie. I don't love him.
Seth:No, me neither.
Dustin:I just. I like, he's. I think he has a place, you know, in movies and stuff, but. I don't know. I don't know. Buy him Spider Man. I don't.
I like the other kid, Toby, whatever his name. That guy.
Seth:Yeah, Toby Maguire. So good.
Dustin:Thought he was good. I enjoyed those Spider Mans. I thought they were great. I'm a big Sam Raimi guy, so I thought those were put together well. But anyway, I don't know.
Just something about kids that. You know, the thing. It's like. It's like we. As soon as we see the kid, we know it's Superman's child. I mean, we. As soon as you see him.
Especially with the. Even with the. They try to. They try to hide it with the asthma, there's. Shut up, dude. Like, that made it even more so.
Seth:Because you got the glasses. He's got the same hair.
Dustin:Yeah. You just see it automatic. And so. I don't know. I just thought it was a little too honky. Like, hey, look at. This is.
You just saw it coming the whole time. I just hate it when I know something that's happening the entire movie where you just know it's about to drop, you know, it was.
I mean, there was a little bit of a suspense with the piano. I did like that scene, him killing the guy with the piano. I thought that was kind of interesting. That was a fun way for me, though.
Seth:I was wondering, like, because obviously they're trying to set up more movies with this one. How do you continue when. When Superman has a kid now? Like, what is the next movie just going to be him, like, trying to train the kid.
How is this working?
Dustin:Yeah. Or he's taking him to Dave and Busters on the weekends, you know, because he's got like his skeeball. He's like. He's breaking the skeeball machine.
Like, here we go again. Superman breaking David Buster. That's a really funny sketch. It is. Superman has the kid on the weekends.
He's just going in, just trying to be a dad, A part time dad. That's really funny. Trying to cook and he's like burning stuff. I think that's funny. He's got to cook with his eyes, you know?
Kyle:Yeah, it's funny you brought that up.
Seth:Scrambled eggs.
Dustin:Yeah, that's hilarious. I got. Nobody ever did that. That's funny.
Kyle:I had a question that didn't make the final cut for questions, but I think I should ask it. I said one of the things I wrote down was, is the only power that Superman is missing is paternity test eyes, maternity test vision. He doesn't know.
Dustin:He just.
Seth:He needs an inner Maury Povich.
Dustin:Also. Also, like, come on, dude, Superman's not supposed to bang people. Like, right? That's not supposed to happen. Batman. Yeah, but not. Not Superman.
That's not supposed. He's supposed to do that. He's supposed to be kind of like, I know he's got a crush on her, but it's supposed to be like a Mormon kind of thing.
He's kind of got a crush, but he doesn't go all the way through with it. Like, I don't know, like that kind of courting and not. Not really being the boyfriend kind of thing. I thought that was.
I don't know, that was part of the whole gig. I didn't know. He's like. Like, where did they do it? Like, what? They do it in the air. Like, what's. You know? When did this kid get conceived? You know?
I don't know. The back of a Honda. Like, what's. I don't know. It's like. You know what I mean?
Seth:That is one of my favorite Family Guy bits where Clark walks into the Daily Planet and all the women are crying and he's like, hey, what's wrong? And he. They go, we all have breast canc. The doctor said it's like, we've Been blasted with X rays for four years straight.
Dustin:Yeah. But I think having intercourse with Superman might kill a woman. And so they don't even put that in there. That could easily kill a woman.
Like, you get it. That's the one time you're vulnerable and excited. You know, I don't want Superman excited in that moment. Like, come on, man.
It's got to kick your torso to pieces. Yeah, that's. They, you know, think any of this thing. Or at least give us that flashback if you're going to talk about it.
At least give us a little bit of the flashback. You don't have to show the graphicness of it. But. But I would have love. That would have made it a cool. That would have made it kind of like a.
A cooler kind of Guardians of Galaxy, you know, it would have given it something if, like, he's just like. So, you know, they're, like, making out and they're looking at a bed or. I don't know, just something funny to kind of imply. It would have been.
I thought that I. I don't know. I think that.
Kyle:Yeah, I think there's an old.
Dustin:He gets her drunk or something. I don't know.
Kyle:Drunk on pomade.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:You. You know, Lois, you're looking. You're looking. You're looking real good tonight.
Dustin:Yeah. They're both wasted. They're both wasted. Like, he falls off, but flies back up and he's like, hey, you know, just. I don't know, just something.
Show us this movie.
Seth:You should have written this movie.
Dustin:Good. Let's rewrite it. I might rewrite a Superman movie. Bring this premise back and do it right.
Seth:We'll talk to James Gunn. We'll get it done.
Dustin:I mean, I'll send a letter. I know a few people. We'll see if maybe get it to him. I may be able to get it to him.
Seth:Here we go.
Dustin:We'll bring you guys in. We'll do it. We'll all three do it. It'll. Yeah. That'll be our podcast. We just write this movie on the air.
Kyle:My first objective will be to write Superman out of the script. Like in act one. I want him gone by Act Two.
Dustin:You hate him, huh?
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:Just out.
Dustin:I. Yeah, yeah.
Seth:You didn't like Batman v Superman better because that's the one where they kill him.
Kyle:That was glorious.
Seth:Yeah. That was his favorite moment of that movie.
Kyle:Finally, Rando.
Dustin:I do kind of like Smallville, though. I've been watching that. That's not bad. Is that okay to say on this podcast? Yeah. Is that okay? Have you. Have you watched it, Kyle?
Kyle:I watch parts of it. I just. I couldn't get into it because it's so. It's a lot of Superman.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:Morally against Superman.
Dustin:Well, I like crappy high school stuff. You know what I mean? Like, I'm a big fan no matter what decade. I just like the bully and the football team and I just like all that crap. I just.
I'm never not into that.
Kyle:Dawson's Creek with Superman.
Dustin:Yeah, well, that's what it is. That's exactly what it is. And that makes it.
That makes me laugh because he likes, you know, when he's like, you know, he starts to play football for the first time, you're like, he made 40 touchdowns. You know, like, it's just funny. It's.
Seth:Like the Incredibles where he's running in that race at the end and they're like, no, no, no. Second place. Second place.
Kyle:Maybe that's where he got all the. Getting girls pregnant when he played quarterback and, you know, at Dawson Creek, you know, Superman style.
He started getting women pregnant at the high school.
Dustin:Exactly.
Kyle:Randos.
Seth:Randos.
Kyle:We love it when our guests say it. You got to get chesty. That was good. We've been ousted again. I love it. First rando here.
There was thousands of hopefuls, thousands of auditions for this Superman role. Singer wanted to do something different, but he also wanted to pay most homage to Christopher Reeve. And Henry Cavill. Actually tested.
Didn't get through. Here are some of the names that auditioned that didn't make it. Josh Hartnett, Brendan Fraser, Ashton Kutcher, Paul Walker, and Matthew Bomer.
Seth:Jim, can you imagine? Can you imagine Ashton Kutcher as Superman? Dude, where's my cape?
Kyle:Dude?
Dustin:I think Josh Hartnett is another one that I think we like more now. And that. That might be interesting, but he was too much of a heartthrob. I think. It wouldn't have worked.
Seth:Yeah, I think Christopher Nolan kind of grounded him with Oppenheimer.
Dustin:Oh, yeah.
Seth:Like, made him more relatable as a person.
Dustin:Yeah, I like them in the Faculty. You ever seen that movie?
Seth:No.
Dustin:Yeah, dude, that's.
Kyle:That's a good one.
Dustin:Yes. That's a badass movie. It's. Yeah, that's. If I give you five to watch, that'd be one of them. It's great. It's really cool soundtrack.
Like, it's like a high school movie, which I'm a big. I'm a perv with the high school movies, dude. High school kids, you know? But no, it's great, though. It's like. It has an alien vibe. It's really cool.
Kyle:You beat me too, with the soundtrack.
Seth:The guy who shows back up at the high school every. Every prom, and everyone's like, who are you? And you're like, I went here 40 years ago.
Dustin:I love high school girls. They stay the same age. All right, all right, all right.
Kyle:Did you remember that song, the from by the Flies on that soundtrack?
Dustin:Yeah. Fantastic. Yeah.
Kyle:Got you where I want you. Total teen music, dude.
Dustin:So good. So I love it.
Kyle:This is the funniest part of this rando, though. Jim Caviezel was one of the more.
He kind of got more advanced through the process, but he ultimately got denied it was because singer thought Passion of the Christ made him too famous. Does that seem a little sacrilegious? Like, listen, dude, you got that Jesus thank on you, bro.
Even though, like, Superman is the pan ultimate Christ, like, figure, story, metaphor, you know.
Seth:Oh, yeah. Because, yeah, everyone complained, especially with man of Steel, that there was too much Christ imagery.
Kyle:Yes. He literally is crucified in the air in man of Steel.
I mean, you're not gonna let the guy that played Jesus, like, you're gonna literally tell him, dude, you're too popular with all the Jesus stuff. Like. Like Passion of the Christ was a mainstream hit.
Dustin:Well, I think it's. Yeah. I mean, it is kind of weird. I'm not gonna lie. I mean, going. You know, you. Because I. I mean, that's an amazing movie. Lacertation.
And so it's like. To go to kind of like. And a lot of those people, you know, they really lose themselves with that stuff. We're all. I'm from Texas, so we all.
We all the same kind of family background, you know, where it's like Sunday school every Sunday and all that. So it's like, you know, also, I think it might have caused some problems if you just switch from Jesus Christ the Lord and our Savior to Superman.
I think it might have been a little bit problem. They know. They know their audit like that. I don't think they would have shifted. You wouldn't have got those people.
They would have been a thing, you know, because people, like, they just see you as that thing. And it's hard. I mean, hard for people to cut from that, you know?
Seth:Yeah.
Kyle:You thought I saved you the first time. You just wait, boy. You just wait, boy.
Seth:You saved my body and now save my soul.
Dustin:That's hilarious. I live in Hollywood and the other day I posted it, but it was like, there's a guy that dresses up like Jesus now. Like it's.
It used to just be like Spider man and like, you know, Freddy Krueger or whatever. Now there's a Jesus and he just hangs out. And it's like Jesus to the Superman.
Seth:Guy who did die a couple years ago.
Dustin:Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah. Well, I. But I was waiting to go across the street.
It was literally Jesus, Spider man and Catwoman just walking in the crosswalk, walking towards me. And it was the greatest thing I'd ever seen. It was just like such a funny starts.
Seth:Like the. Sounds like the beginning of a potentially really racist joke.
Dustin:Yeah, yeah, exactly. Or an Angel Studios movie. You know, it's like. I'm sure it's in the works where they combine.
Kids love superheroes and we need to get more Jesus, you know? I don't know.
Kyle:That is still somehow a metaphor for the Odyssey by Homer. You know, when in doubt, just say it's. This is based on the Iliad.
Dustin:You know, somebody went to community college. I like it.
Kyle:I barely made it, baby. Northwest Arkansas Community College. I swam in the fountain in the back.
Dustin:Good for you. I went to art school. It is. We. We learned nothing.
Seth:I went to Belmont. We had a nice mix of Christian stuff in. In, in with everything I was learning in audio and film. So that was fun.
Dustin:I love it.
Kyle:Yeah. The funny. Another funny part of this. Randall Ralph, actually, when he met Singer, spilled coffee all over Singer's lap. And he.
Dustin:He.
Kyle:Yeah, and. And Singer loved it because like, he was like, that's the kind of bumbling Clark Kent thing that would actually happen.
And that's actually what sealed the deal.
Dustin:Oh, Bet you a thousand dollars, Kyle. That was on purpose.
Kyle:It had to be.
Dustin:He was.
Seth:He's out in the audition room, he's just like, watch this.
Dustin:No, I think it was. I mean, you're like, you know what I mean? Like, it's. That's like an impromptu move. Like, it just like, you know, I could see. Actors are crazy, dude.
They want that part so bad. It's life changing these moments. So you're like, you know, you're close. Like, watch this, you know? Hey, I'm Clark. Brandon. Ralph.
Seth:Unfortunately, it was life changing for the worst. I don't think he got much work after this.
Dustin:He didn't, right?
Kyle:Not a lot.
Seth:Shockingly, Kate Bosworth has kept insanely busy since this movie. I looked at her IMDb.
Dustin:I don't know about insanely. I mean, she's worse.
Seth:I looked at her IMDb yesterday.
Dustin:Should be a bigger.
Seth:She's made like she should be, but she makes like three to five movies a year.
Dustin:Yeah, it's like back in the day we had the straight to vhs. It's kind of that, you know, I feel like that's kind of the quality it's got. Like, it's something like 50 cents probably in most of her movies.
It's like, you know what I mean? Like, she's good. I think she's like little small parts. She was in Barbarian. Did you see that?
I guess she played one of the, like, I guess people that the guy stalked or whatever. But yeah, I think it's. Yeah, she's good. She was. Blue Crush is great. I mean, I love her. I think she's great, but I don't.
Seth:Think she was right as. As Lois. But I don't think she's the worst option.
Dustin:Horrible. I mean, Lois is not that attractive either. That's why it works in the first one. She's not a bombshell.
Superman has some substance to him, you know, Even though he's a GQ looking guy, he still kind of likes a woman that's strong and ballsy and smokes cigarettes.
Seth:Kansas taste to him.
Dustin:Yeah, Yeah. I forget her name. Margot Kidder. Is that her name? Who that was? Yep. Yeah, she was.
I don't know, she's kind of just not traditional and I think it somehow works, you know, better that way. Yeah.
Kyle:That's why I hate Lois Lane as a character, because she's a Superman enabler. No one enables Superman. It's just bad for me. It's bad for my personal taste. Just enabling.
Dustin:It's just Superman all the time. It's just nice. When you don't have a love story. It rarely happens, you know? I like it.
Seth:Kyle's just jealous that he doesn't get more attractive when he takes his glasses off.
Dustin:Yeah, put them on. Put them back on immediately. Put them back on. Put it back on. All right. That was literally wild. That was wild.
Kyle:I look like a bowl of jello.
Dustin:I don't. I don't take my hat off. I get it. We all have our thing.
Kyle:By the way, I love the hat you wear on stage though, dude. Like, because I'm a hat guy.
Dustin:You're.
Kyle:You're like, I just got myself a wide brim. Straw hat. I love your hat game.
Dustin:Yeah. Big fan of the open road. Stetson. I got about 10 of them.
Kyle:Yeah, that's what it was, the Stetson.
Dustin:Yeah. There's great hat, dude. Yeah, Hats off. I love it. Hats off to you.
Kyle:We'll Go.
Dustin:We'll go. We'll go hat shopping in Nashville. There you go. We'll be.
Kyle:We'll be so cute.
Dustin:We would. I'll hold your hand the whole time. Great.
Seth:I'll hold the camera.
Dustin:Don't be jealous.
Kyle:Steamy in here.
Dustin:Don't be jealous.
Seth:Of only fans.
Kyle:Right?
Dustin:All right. Get us on track, Kyle. Get us back on track. Give us. Get us back on track. Come on.
Kyle:Two more. Two more randos. There we go. This was going to be dedicated to Christopher Reeve and Vax.
In fact, they had a cameo planned for him, but he died pretty close to when they kicked off, off production. But they were going to do a cameo as an older Superman, which.
I don't know how they would work that in, but they wanted to do a cameo of an older Superman with Christopher. And would they have. I mean, this isn't meant to be a disrespectful question, but obviously the wheelchair, like, what were they going to do?
Dustin:Well, I mean, you know, Top Gun, the last Top Gun, they did a pretty respectful job bringing in Val Kilmer, as I said, and being he couldn't speak and all those things. And so, yeah, they found a clever kind of respectful way to do that. So they probably might have been able to. I mean, it would depend.
I mean, the taste of this movie was kind of back and forth. So I don't know. I mean, I feel like we kind of know how to do that now, but back then, it's like, I don't know.
I mean, they were harassing young boys on set or whatever was happening in that movie. So God knows if they would have. If they would have, like, respectfully presented Christopher Reeves. I don't know. I don't know.
I don't trust any of the. Anybody on that set. So I don't know. I don't know. It was wild, wild times. Is that not supposed to do that? Sorry. I know.
Kyle:No, it's amazing. I'm trying to regain my own composure. But no, you were amazing.
Dustin:I'm just like, all right, but. You know what I mean? I don't know. I. I mean, I guess, but. Oh, well, let's talk about that. Does Superman age? Does he age?
Kyle:Yeah, that's another thing. I don't think so.
Seth:I have a feeling in the comics they've addressed that at some point. But I am not very, very well versed in the comics. But I do feel like there's an old version of Superman, so he ages.
Dustin:Okay. All right, so it's like, so he can't fly at night. Like.
Kyle:He needs X ray goggles instead of.
Dustin:Actually, somebody's got to use that one on stage.
Kyle:Write it down, bro.
Dustin:It's like bumping into buildings. How's it going? He walks it in. Hey, that's so funny. That's the movie we're taking next hours.
Seth:Just nothing but Superman jokes.
Dustin:Well, we got, well, a movie, I mean, an old Superman. That's a hilarious movie. That would so funny. Nick Cage could do that. That would be.
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Cataracts, you know, it's funny. I, I, I live by Runyon Canyon and Kevin Smith. I see him every, like every other morning and he's always walking around.
I mean, I'll just pitch him, go. Hey, yeah, I know you were going to do the Superman. Like I got, Hear me out. Superman 76, right?
Seth:That's his age.
Dustin:Yeah. He's got to wear those glasses, those catacomb, you know, those old people wear, like, I'm telling you, it's gonna be hilarious.
Seth:Big old bifocals. And whenever he looks through the wrong lens, the laser comes out. Weird.
Dustin:Yeah, he's always, he's always like, you know, capturing the wrong people. It's like, I'm not a villain. What are you talking about, dude? I'm just on my way to work like sleuth.
Kyle:Just falling for Social Security scams through text message all the time.
Dustin:Damn it.
Kyle:I owe the irs. I didn't pay my toll.
Seth:He accidentally kidnaps Joe Rogan because he's bald and he thinks he's Lex Luthor.
Dustin:Yeah, right. I mean this is the greatest movie ever. This has to happen.
Kyle:The old super amazing, so funny last rando here. This is, this is actually kind of maddening here. So I had heard about this and did a lot of research to, to figure out.
This is just pure Hollywood here. There was an alternate opening scene which you can see on the Blu ray, but they took it out. It was, it was, they called this scene Return to Krypton.
And it was going to be Brandon Ralph flying around, he comes back to the ruins of a ship on Krypton. It was insanely CGI heavy. And this scene that they omitted cost $10 million to make.
Dustin:Oh, wow.
Kyle:And it didn't even, they didn't even go for it.
Dustin:It.
Kyle:Talk about a false start, huh?
Dustin:You know, I don't know. What was that? What was that? Was it Schneider movie? That was like three hours. Justice League. Wasn't that like three hours?
Seth:Yeah, the Snyder cut.
Dustin:Yeah, I'm okay with that. I would rather have that. And just like if you're locked into this story, then you're gonna enjoy it if, you know, you're a Superman head or whatever.
I would rather them do that than chop up the way this movie was chopped. I feel like that might have been a cool scene it made. It may have given it more depth. Depth. Because that's what I felt was lacking in this movie.
It felt like something was cut here and there.
I feel like just when it was started to get good or whatever, you feel like nothing ever really resolved or nothing kept moving or, you know, I don't know. So you never know. That scene might have made it better. But I know back then it was like everybody was like, you know, making music videos almost.
You know, Everything had to be like, pop, pop, pop, pop, you know? Yeah. Because they were editing for our adds, you know, and then it. Then. Now. And then long movies became popular again, you know? Know.
But I think it's. I don't know. It might have made it better. I don't know. I don't know if that Justice League that. That made that movie better.
Probably not, but I don't mind a long movie. I'm. I'm into long movies. I think I like the Snyder cut. Do you? Yeah. I mean, I like it.
I think it's just ballsy and it's like very Tarantino and, like, do whatever you want. And, like, I'm into it. I think it's like, yeah, why not? If you get. You.
You have the ability to come up with a movie and write and direct and make it happen. It's like, do what you want, man. Nobody's telling Bruce Springsteen to stop making music. An hour and a. You know, they're like, keep going.
You know, nobody's like, who cares? These guys just keep moving. I don't know. I don't know. That's. Maybe that would help. Maybe not. I don't know. This movie had a lot of problems.
And take Kevin Spacey out of it, it'd probably been the number one thing.
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Dog eating. Less dog eating would be nice. Yeah.
Seth:Yeah. Let's take two predators away from the movie. And then maybe it would have gotten better.
Dustin:What did this guy do after Superman? What was his big movie movie? You got singers? No, no, no. The.
Kyle:Ralph.
Dustin:Ralph. What. What did he star in? What did he star in after this? Because it gives you a little bit of momentum. You get roles.
Even though you might be typecast, you're still getting like three or four movies after this.
Kyle:Scott Pilgrim versus the World.
Dustin:Okay. That's a pretty Good one. Okay.
Seth:He wasn't Chuck, okay.
Kyle:He did some tv.
Dustin:That was a TV series. Chuck. Okay.
Seth:Yep.
Kyle:Yeah, the Flash TV series.
Dustin:Okay.
Kyle:The rookie, right? Tv. He did a lot of tv.
Dustin:Okay, Because.
Seth:Because the CW did that big crossover show, DC's Legends of Tomorrow, where it kind of brought in different DC characters from different properties. So you had like, Brandon Ralph, Superman, but you also had like the TV show Flash, like that kind of stuff.
Dustin:Okay, that's fun.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:All right, well, that's cool, because it's not his shall we War. You know what I mean? Not his fault.
Seth:Yeah, yeah, he definitely switched over to a lot of TV after this.
Dustin:Yeah, I think that's what happens.
Kyle:I'm just gonna blame him. I'm gonna say it is his fault.
Dustin:You can't believe space. You can't blame this guy.
Seth:Spacey and Singer, it's both of their faults.
Kyle:I mean, aside, take the perv away from spacy, right? Just take that out of the equation. He's still. Even if you remove that from him, he still seems like the kind of guy that. Everyone has a Spacey story.
Dustin:Yeah, you're starting to hear it too. I mean, every, every clip on your phone, you're like, good Lord.
Kyle:But didn't he punch a three year old trying to get cotton candy at.
Dustin:The.
Kyle:At the carnival?
Dustin:I would like him if he did that. That, that would. I would like. You know what I mean? That's something.
Seth:Image. A little.
Dustin:Yeah, but it's. Yeah, it was way worse.
Kyle:That is my cotton candy.
Seth:I do like that. Brandon Routh's big movie after this was Zach and Miri. Make a porno.
Dustin:Did he?
Kyle:That sounds like the next one.
Dustin:What are you playing? It was he like office.
Seth:It was just one of the random dudes who was. I guess he was like, helping them shoot. Oh, he was Bobby Long. He was one of the porn stars.
Dustin:Ah, that's fun. Yeah. Superman to porn star. Yeah. Yeah, that makes more sense in the.
Seth:Seth Rogen, Kevin Smith movie.
Dustin:Yeah, yeah. Oh, it was. That was Kevin Smith. Yeah, yeah.
Kyle:I was gonna say maybe he played the copy machine repairman of the 70s born.
Dustin:Well, I brought up Tarantino. He loves this movie. He was saying if you read that, like. But he was saying that he loves this Superman Returns movie.
Like this specific movie he loves. And he was like, interesting. Yeah, it's. I mean, he likes.
Seth:He does have some crazy takes though, sometimes.
Dustin:Oh, well, he liked Joker too, which, Yeah, I kind of did too, because I, I saw the tongue in Cheek in it and I think a Lot of people, like, wanted to see something else, and I was kind of. I don't know. I didn't. I didn't hate. I. And I also think I got off on liking it and that everybody hated it.
And so that kind of fueled me wanting to like it probably more than I actually did. But it was so fun to be on Facebook or Instagram, just be like, I thought it was the best movie I've seen.
And everybody goes, what are you talking about? And then everybody just goes crazy. It was so fun to gasl people over a ridiculous Joker movie. It was just so fun. Yeah.
Kyle:But shall we war?
Dustin:Sorry?
Seth:Let's war.
Dustin:Go ahead.
Kyle:No, it's great.
Dustin:War. What's war? No, dogs. Leaving dogs. Shall we punch kids? That's fine. Don't punch a dog. Don't eat a dog.
Kyle:Oh, my God. Should we hatch the equivalent to a timeshare scam to attack Superman?
Dustin:Shouldn't we?
Kyle:What's more, that really was like a timeshare.
Seth:It was hilarious.
Dustin:The movie. It was the timeshare.
Kyle:No, the island thing.
Dustin:Oh, the island thing. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It just. Yeah, it's just wasn't enough behind it. Like, I just can't figure it out. Like, I lost a lot of interest.
It was really hard not to be on your phone watching this.
Kyle:Yeah, agreed.
Seth:And considering Batman Begins came out a year before this, where Ra's Al Gould's entire motivation was to, like, tear down the corruption of society, and then we come to this, it's like, I'm gonna build myself a new land.
Dustin:Yeah. And X Men came out before this. Right. That's how he got this gig. It did, right?
Seth:Which one?
Dustin:X Men. Yeah, Bryan Singer did. Because I thought that was a good movie. I liked it. Yeah. I. I really enjoyed it.
I mean, that opening scene with Wolverine where he's fighting in the ring, like. Like that's what this movie was missing. Oh, that was kind of gritty. Because Brian has it in him, you know, to make a good movie.
I mean, Usual Suspects is fantastic. Like, he has a good. It's just, you know, this movie. I felt like he was trying too hard.
Sometimes they're trying too hard to honor a movie instead of kind of making a throw. Because I think he could have made a cool movie. Like, I think he had that genius in him, but I think.
I think that was the mistake, trying to honor and do and whatever. And he tried to get John Williams and try to get the soundtrack acted the same. And I think all that was too much.
I think he should have gone his own direction, made him put him in a black suit. Who knows? Like, switch it up, you know, I don't know. That's. That's what was cool about X Men. They were all. Now we.
Well, after that we craved the yellow suit again. But it was kind of cool when it came out. Everybody had black suits and.
Kyle:Yeah, yeah.
Dustin:So I don't know. He should have put more of a stamp on it. That was, that's where he fell flat.
Kyle:Agreed. All right. The way the scorecard works, we have seven categories. So we. And you basically say yes. No. Two out of three wins.
It just like the NBA playoffs. And we have a yes and a no category and we always take them from the movie. Dustin.
So yes, if you dig it, if you like the cast or whatever category it is. Super duper. That's our yes.
Dustin:Super duper. Zs. Okay. And what's.
Kyle:And if you don't like it negative. You hate it. Super meh.
Dustin:Super meh. Okay.
Seth:Singer barely know her.
Kyle:Singer, Barely know her. We can switch it. We always can. That's a movie worst tradition.
Seth:Superman.
Kyle:Superman. And the first five categories are traditional cast filmmaking. But the last two, we call them bro categories.
Basically they're comedic or film specific categories. So we'll get going right now with the top bill cast. Brandon Ralph, Kevin Spacey, Kate Bosworth. What do you think? Seth?
Seth:I, you know, I am going to go super mad.
I, I don't think any of them necessarily did a bad job, but I don't think any of them did anything spectacular like we've been ripping on Kevin Spacey this whole time. There's a lot with his character. I'd say there's a lot wrong with it.
I think Brandon Routh did what he could with what he was given, same with Kate Bosworth. But none of them are really that, that stellar to me. So it's a Superman on my part.
Dustin:Boom.
Kyle:Dustin.
Dustin:I feel that Kevin Spacey talked Brian Singer into casting him as Lex Luthor.
Seth:They met.
Dustin:Yeah, well, I mean, you know, they did a movie together. You know, they're very much. Yeah. But, but I think that happens a lot. Like these directors.
Like, I feel like it's kind of hard to shake an actor sometimes, you know, where it's like you do a movie with him that's successful or whatever, and then you're like, you know, he's, you know, how are you gonna say no to this guy? He's at the top of his thing right now and he's just like, yeah, I want to do, like, why wouldn't you? You'd be awesome.
And, like, instead of maybe doing a casting call and, like, trying to get, you know, Willem Defo or whoever, like, just crazy people and see who would really, like, make the role better. So that alone. Yeah, I. You know. And Kevin, you know, the chick or whatever, Katie. What's her name again?
Seth:Kate Bosworth.
Dustin:Kate Bosworth. Yeah. You know, I thought she had some moments, and I liked a lot of her moments, but. And again, just stop with the dumb kids.
So I'm gonna say super meh.
Kyle:Love it. I go super mess so hard. Super meh. Just me.
Dustin:I just.
Kyle:I do like the movie seven. I do like Kevin Spacey there for whatever reason. But I kind of just.
And I don't know if you guys have any examples of this in your own life, but you kind of just assume. It's like, I think Kevin Spacey's probably a great actor, and I've just always thought that. But I look back at his.
His repertoire, and I'm just like, dude, is Kevin. Kevin Spacy everywhere? All the time. He has one volume, and that is like volume 11. Kevin Spacy. And he's actually not that dynamic. Not as.
Even when you watch, like, American Beauty.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:He's just saying.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:Here's what I'll say about that. You have two different types of actors. You have actors who need good writing to be good actors, and Kevin Spacey, I think, is one of them.
And then you have people who.
The best example I could come up with is Liam Neeson in the Phantom Menace, where despite the awful writing, he brought gravitas to the words that were being said. So even if he was saying ridiculous shit, it was coming out in such a decent way that it didn't sound as bad as it could.
Kyle:Yeah. Yeah.
Dustin:Darth Maul is still one of the best Star wars villains. Oh, my God. Yeah. It's. The writing, for sure. I mean, has a lot to do with it, but it's just like. I don't know. I just. I had a thought and I lost it.
Kevin. He's making me so mad. Kevin Spacey.
Kyle:But he does. He makes. He has that effect on people.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:And Ralph. Ralph is the bottom of the barrel of a character I already hate. And he is the worst version of it I've seen. So.
Seth:Yeah, I would.
Kyle:It's unfortunate.
Dustin:He.
Kyle:He's probably a really nice guy, too. I hope he doesn't. I'm sure he's so nice, but I'm sorry.
Dustin:Yeah, well. And I agree. I here's the deal. This is what you do. You either go all in with, like, famous actors. That's how you catch your movie.
Or you Star Wars 77 it. And you just do people nobody knows and you take. And everybody. You take a risk on these young, fresh, whatever. And the whole cast is that.
That you either do that or you. But don't do half and half.
The main character should not be a dude that, you know, kind of barely acted his way through it and then also is missing all the key elements that make him a Superman. So, yeah, it's. It's definitely. I don't know, because definitely felt like.
Seth:They were casting a Christopher Reeves lookalike and not a good actor necessarily.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:Because exactly what they did.
Dustin:That's the Christopher Reeve story. It was like he was kind of like, you saw him and you saw Superman, and so he got the part. And so, you know, yeah, don't bring.
Kyle:In Kevin Spacey to grab his ass in between takes. You know, that's just not fair. It's not nice.
Dustin:Evan Spacy. Yeah. I don't buy.
Kyle:0 to 1.
Dustin:Yeah. I don't buy it that he's a great actor.
I think it's like, I think he's like, he's good at being that, and that's not easy, but he's kind of like a Ryan Reynolds in a lot of ways where it's like, like, you know, he's good at being that dude. But. And especially with the writing.
I mean, Ryan Reynolds seems so much funnier when he's got Deadpool riding with him, you know, but it's like outside of that, when he. When he's trying to be funny and it's him, you're like, okay, easy with your Mick, your mint, you know, cell phone commercial.
Like, you know, it's like, yeah, you could tell when it's his writing. Yeah.
Kyle:That'S a good comparison.
Dustin:He's also mean to a friend of mine, so, you know, on set. So I, you know, comedian. Yeah.
Kyle:We will revenge your friend. Let's add Ryan Reynolds to the scorecard.
Dustin:He played the bartender in Death Pole, so.
Kyle:Oh, really?
Seth:Oh, I know who you're talking about.
Dustin:Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Kyle:Boo. Ryan Reynolds. Zero.
Dustin:Boo.
Kyle:Zero to one. So far, we are super meh. Superman supporting cast. Here we go.
And there was a bunch of people I did not recognize, so I'm just going to stick to the ones that we may know. James Marsden, who for now, I'm a Die Hard Walton Goggins fan. Like, Die Hard, but for a long Time.
I thought James Marsden was Walton Goggins and Walt Goggins was James Marsden.
Dustin:Just a couple of white.
Kyle:A couple of copy and paste white guys. In my opinion. Parker Posey is Kitty. And then Perry White, Frank Franklin, Jella, which was. We'll get to that.
And then Sam Huntington as Jim Olson and Cowpen. It's funny. What was that?
Seth:Cow pen.
Kyle:Cow pen, yeah. Yeah. As the silent Stanford. And then they got Marlon Brando on here because of the archive footage, but.
Dustin:Oh, right. That was like the first judges, I think. The first cgi, like, Dead Person Coming back, I think.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Maybe could be the first one where they did that. So. Yeah.
Kyle:What do y' all think?
Seth:I'm actually gonna go super duper on this. As much as I did not like the main cast, I actually felt like the supporting cast stood out significantly better. I like James Marsden.
I like that of all the people Brian Singer could have brought back from the X Men series, he brought back him. I love him in Westworld. I think he's just a fantastic actor all the way around.
Even though Cal Pen didn't say much, like, it was cool just to see him there.
Dustin:The.
Seth:What was the woman's name? The. The Kevin Spacey's girlfriend.
Kyle:That would have been Parker Posey.
Seth:I thought she did a fantastic job for the character she was playing. So, yeah, I actually. I really like the supporting cast in this, so I'll go super duper on it.
Kyle:Love it.
Dustin:Yeah. I mean, yeah, I'll go a little super duper because I do like. I do like Parker Posey, and I do like that James dude. I think he's good.
I would have loved to had a scene where, like, you know, he's drunk or something and he tries to fight Superman over his woman. And, like, it goes. You know what I mean? Like, he hits his chest and hurts his hand or something.
Like, just a funny little scene of him just, like, you know, standing up to this dude because he's creeping in on his woman, you know, even though. And we don't know the child. You're. We don't know the child thing yet.
So it's like, you know, that would have been more of a. I would love to have seen that, actually. But, yeah, it was not bad.
Kyle:So you're going. You have a slight. We call it a squeak.
Seth:We call it a squeak. Over is our scale that we use on the Movie wars podcast.
Dustin:And Parker Posies. I. She have a big crush on her. I love her. She's been amazing and everything. So, yeah, so good.
Kyle:Yeah, I go super mess so hard here. I. Parker Posey was the only one I liked and I, I just. There's just nothing happening here.
And I didn't name the kid because I couldn't find him because they have his adult picture. I'm pretty sure. I'm trying to look for who he is now, but.
Dustin:Oh, is he. Is he like on drugs and stuff now? What's probably.
Kyle:Yeah, you just have to assume that. Right?
Dustin:Yeah. Dui, his headshot. He's like all like.
Kyle:Yeah. Public indecency and decent exposure. That's always. Just got to get it out next to the 7 11. But yeah, I pissed me off.
Dustin:That kid took it. Yeah.
Kyle:For the whole movie.
Dustin:Yeah, go ahead.
Kyle:Sorry, just nothing here. I just. Yeah, no one's hooking me. And this is. And this is a big thing for me and Seth's probably tired here a bit. When it comes to just cast.
Like I'm always looking for a supporting cast, someone just in that second tier just to kind of hook me. Kind of hook me into the movie.
Dustin:Yeah, those, those two actors that we both like, James and Parker, like they didn't hook you. They were just not terrible when you were watching them in the scene. And they're interesting. So they.
So you stayed watching them and like they did, you know, but that's about it.
Seth:At that point. I would probably blame the script more than I blame them for how bland their characters.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:But again, I think they brought everything they could to the. To what they were doing.
Dustin:Yeah, they couldn't really go anywhere. I thought Parker Posey, she's incredibly funny. They should have better lines for her, you know?
Seth:Seriously.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Yep.
Kyle:All right, one to one. Next category. Writing. And we have some interesting, some interesting creds here for the writing.
So obviously Brian Singer was one of the writers, but Michael Dougherty wrote X Men 2. Or actually X 2. X Men United. There's so many of those movies. Krumpus, Trick or treat. And he also. Yeah, he wrote those so well.
Oh, Godzilla versus Kong he wrote as well. And he wrote X Men Apocalypse. He's got a long list of these. He's kind of in this vein. So what do you think? So what do you think about the writing?
Seth:Was it just the two of them? I thought there were three people who wrote it.
Kyle:There is a third. There is a third. Let me go back. Dan Harris.
Seth:Okay.
Kyle:As well.
Seth:Is there anything of note that he did?
Kyle:Dan Harris, imaginary Heroes. He also was a co writer on X Men United. Speech and debate.
Seth:Okay.
Kyle:He was actually the director of that film. And yeah, those are the. Oh, Urban legends. Bloody Mary. Oh, straight to video Urban legends movie. Speaking of college movies.
Urban legends, that's like. That's like discount store. I know what you did last summer.
Dustin:Yeah, yeah.
Seth:For me it's gonna be a super meh.
I think the biggest problem with this movie is is the script because I think even with the cast that we had had the script been significantly better, we would have had had much more for the actors to do.
Unfortunately, I don't think it's totally fair to say that Brandon Routh did a terrible job because I don't think he was given anything good to work with.
And, and as, as I said with James Marsden and Parker Posey, they were somehow able to rise above the bad script and, and put out a reasonably decent performance. But I think the script is really what crippled everybody in this situation.
Especially with the fact that, that the villain's entire plan is just make land and flood the us like what the hell? What are we doing here? Who came up with that? So it's super meh for me.
Dustin:We all kind of want to do that right now.
Kyle:But yeah, yeah, I would love a good flood just to drowned. Have a dolphin surviving next to my floating bloated corpse.
Dustin:If you guys come out to la, which you should, you could both sleep on my couch and you could be out there in Aug. You should. I should be back if I. I have to check out the dates.
But Universal is right by me and they have a water world spectacular and it's pretty, pretty great. Oh, amazing.
Kyle:Be a great place to die.
Dustin:I don't know. I just thought of dolphins and whatever breaking dolphins. Dolphins just.
But you get to see a guy like, you know, through, through like a hoop that's on fire, just in a jet ski. It's pretty great.
Kyle:What do you think about writing, Dustin? Yes, sir.
Dustin:Well, I do think this. I think it needs to be a new rule. Here's my.
I don't want to Bill Maher this, but the new rule is I think you only get one superhero movie as a director and a writer. And it's like unless it's incredibly exceptional.
And I don't even think X Men was as great as like a Christopher Nolan, you know, like, like so I think. And so it's like, like.
And I think what's great about like when like a guy like Christopher Nolan takes you know, like the reigns on a superhero movie, he puts something else in it. Whereas like this has like superhero formula written all over it and I think that's the problem with the writing.
It feels like it's got that X Men thing. It's got that look. It's got that editing. It's got that quickness to. It feels like.
I don't know, it just doesn't have his own identity, and it feels just very manufactured as a superhero movie the kids will love and it'll make a lot of money, and that's what it feels. You know, what is happening with this writing? And so nothing said. Like I said, I thought the first one was funny. I thought the second one was funny.
I thought, you know. And then they tried to do the third one with Richard Pryor, but that wasn't funny, even though they had. Richard was kind of on his last leg.
But I feel like, you know, I like a superhero with a little bit of movie, a little bit of, like, humor. And so when I see the writing, I want. You know, I want a little bit of that.
Seth:I mean. Yeah, even Christian Bale and Michael Caine were cracking jokes to each other in the in the Dark trilogy.
Dustin:Christian Bale's very funny. And so. I mean, Kane. Forget it. Yeah, he's great.
Seth:Oh, yeah.
Dustin:So. So, yeah, you need a little bit of that. It was just missing all of that. There's kind of like. They tried to.
You know, I think casting Parker Posey was part of that, but just didn't work. Just. So go. Just have you. Look, the dog eats the dog. Huh? You like that?
Seth:It'll be edgy.
Dustin:It'll be edgy. Wrote that on set and you're just like, what? Stop.
Seth:He's like, we got all this fur in the mail. I don't know where it's from. We'll just have the dog eat the other dog.
Dustin:H. That was so gross and weird.
Seth:Oh, nasty.
Kyle:So you're definitely a super me.
Dustin:Yeah. Sorry. Super man.
Kyle:It was incredible. I've once again been announced it on my own show.
Dustin:Yeah, the show all the time. I'm gonna. I'm gonna be like the. The Correspondent or something. Okay. I live in a Chinese theater. I'll just walk by and interview people.
What'd you think of Superman Returns? What?
Kyle:2006, live from Universal.
Dustin:I just keep ask. That's the only movie I ask about. Like. Like, we never let it go that this was bad. Like, I think it should be, like, the end of every episode.
We just talk. We just somehow bring it back, back, and you're just like, again, super bad. Superman.
Kyle:Great idea.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:This. This is a Superman. This is not. This is just Copy and paste stock writing. None of the characters are interesting. There's not interesting dialogue.
And I just. Again, I'm constantly. Because Seth has just immersed me in the culture of Superman this past year.
I'm just looking for a reason to like the character her. And I just.
Dustin:There's.
Kyle:To me, there's always too many questions about his abilities. And, like, you asked if he can get older earlier. It just feels like there's so many, like, things that we just don't think about.
We just kind of accept was in. Like, he got her pregnant. It's like, can he get, well, human pregnant? It's just like, yeah.
Oh, I guess we'll just accept it because they wrote it in here. Yeah.
Seth:How does Kryptonian sperm work?
Dustin:Yeah, yeah. And he could have busted out of his mom. Like, you know, like, that's dangerous, dude. Yeah.
Kyle:Oh, yeah.
Seth:There's.
Kyle:There's a lot of risk.
Dustin:Like the scene in Aliens, he just busts out of the stomach. I mean, that would. Now, if you would have opened with that scene, I would have been like, all right, you can have kids in this movie if they.
If you lead with him busting out of his mom's stomach. Like, I'm into that.
Kyle:More uterine stuff, please.
Dustin:More uterus breaks. He bites the cord with his own teeth. Like, he already has teeth because he's super baby. You know, he's got teeth already.
Seth:Already has the perfect curly Q hair.
Dustin:Oh, yeah, his curly hair.
Kyle:Oh, that's my mom's placenta.
Dustin:That's so gross.
Kyle:Come on. You're saying that took it there? We're talking about busted out and that. That took it too far. Damn it. Just bring that flood.
Bring it the words one to two. It's not a great journey for our hero. So far, directing Brian Singer and I wanted to. I forget he's done so much stuff. What are some of his other.
Seth:Not one.
Dustin:Seth.
Seth:Most recently, he walked off the set out of nowhere from Bohemian Rhapsody, and they still credited him as director. But that, I think, is his most recent endeavor. I think he did Days of Future Past from X Men.
He did all three of the original X Men movies, and there's definitely a couple others in there. But he. He really got involved in the superhero genre early on.
Dustin:Well, usual Suspects is his. You know. Yeah, that's his biggest big banana. And I think after that, people offered him all kinds of stuff.
Kyle:So I'm sure any produced house. The Show House. That's a good one. That's a good credit.
Seth:I forgot about that.
Dustin:Yeah. Is he canceled, though? I don't think he works anymore, I guess off the set.
Seth:Oh, no, he's. He's fully canceled. After everything that went down on Bohemian Rhapsody and then learning that he's, like, every bit as gross as Kevin Spacey.
Yeah, he's just done.
Dustin:Okay, he's done. I mean, he made his money, I guess he made his mark. He had some good movies, you know, know, Wolverine to the screen. That's pretty cool.
Seth:He did. But overall, I'd say he's definitely a super meh when it comes to this, obviously, seeing how involved he was with the writing.
Because I know he also did the. Because. Because I saw that he was on the story and the writing team, so he.
He came up with the concept with a couple other guys and then brought it to his script writers to write it with them. And it just. There again, I was so on board for that first 45 minutes, and then it's just. It just turned into something stupid.
Dustin:I mean, I will say this about the directing, and that has a lot to do with the cinematography. It looked great. You know, it looked good. I thought it looked category. Oh, okay. Go ahead. Sorry. Yeah, well. Oh, yeah.
Seth:Well, yeah, yeah, yeah. I agree with you. It's a beautiful looking movie.
But as far as just strictly from a director standpoint, we see so many flat performances from a lot of actors and. And something I've always said on this podcast is if one person is overacting, it's their fault.
If everybody's doing a bad job acting, it's the director's fault. And to me, that's what this felt like was he just did not have the proper direction for this movie. So it's a Superman for me.
Dustin:Yeah. And they were missing, like, two actors that could have somebody. Like, they just. Yeah.
Seth:Just should have had Jim Caviezel.
Dustin:Maybe not.
Kyle:We needed more.
Seth:Jesus.
Dustin:Well, he's broody. I think a Superman's broody. I think he's a little more broody, and I think that dude's definitely broody. I think I was. I like a superhero. That's.
I mean, that's why I like Batman probably the best. I like a broody, like, weight on the shoulders kind of. I mean, Superman's got the weight on his shoulders, but he's got special powers.
So it's like, like, you know, I don't feel that bad for you.
Seth:There's a reason I have that tattoo and not Superman.
Dustin:Yeah. I mean, but at the same time, you know, Batman is a one percenter. Yeah.
Seth:It's true.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:Superman's a one percenter in powers, so I mean, that's true.
Dustin:That's true. He got, yeah, he's like a Bezos. He's got Bezos powers. He can, he can order all his equipment online.
Kyle:Yeah, yeah. Two day shipping on a battering.
Dustin: y much of that era of the mid-:You know, kind of everything looks the same. I, you know, that's what was so refreshing about Christopher Nolan's vision. And you know, I like a different.
Even Raimi me felt more comical but had, you know, had some brightness to it where this movie didn't have a lot of that stuff. So. Yeah, I, I didn't, I didn't. I don't know. I think if you have better writing, you're gonna have direct a better movie.
You know, if you have better actors, you're going to direct a better movie. So I feel. Man.
Seth:But again, all of that is kind of his decision because he wasn't writing. He was the one who cast.
Dustin:He messed it all up. He messed it all up for sure. Yeah. But I don't, you know, know. But I'm just saying one little change. It might, he might have directed a better one.
But like you said, if he made the choices, it's like, you know.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Doesn't matter.
Kyle:Yeah. Superman. An octave lower.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:This is definitely super mad. There is literally. This is bland. Bland. This is a bland movie. It's a romance movie. There's not a lot of. There's really not a lot of Supermaning in it.
There's not a lot of action.
Dustin:Yeah, it's. It's a, it's a love story without boobs. Like not even, like it's not even good. Not even.
Kyle:No super boobs.
Dustin:No super boobs. One boob shop would have changed everything. Anybody get it and take any ideas from the 80s? Like, yeah, yeah, it's one boob shop. It's a better movie.
Kyle:This is the most bland.
You know, it's bad when I'm like craving the Snyder versions because I'm like, I, I'm not saying I'm, I'm full on respecting Snyder after this, but I am saying, like, if I had to pick. There's such an obvious choice. At least Snyder tried to do something completely different.
Actually, even though I don't think it did great, he at least translated and tried to inject something original. This is just bland. And he's stalking her and she's he's got a kid. I just think there's so many choices here. He's.
He's trying to pay homage to Donner for his. His films and kind of does that, but then he kind of deviates in ways that I think even Donner would have been like, what?
Seth:Like what?
Kyle:So just dumb. Just super meh.
Seth:Like I said, I love that it's technically a soft sequel to the Donner movies, but it's only five years in universe, so we already have cell phones.
Dustin:Yeah. Stay retro, man. I love retro. I love everything about it. It just makes me happy.
Happy when you see, like, put the cassette into the thing and then, like, you know, the Members Only jacket and the thing. I love that. I love a good. And especially with a superhero movie, you know, it's like. That's what's so great about the Guardians is, like, the music.
Everything's retro. Like, you know, it's like the. That scene where he's got the Walkman and it's like, I love that, like, do that. That would have.
That would have automatically made it a better movie.
Seth:Yeah, absolutely.
Kyle:One to three. It is super may up in here. A couple of categories left. What's in front of us? Cinematography, product design, sound, costumes, editing, stunts.
Dustin:Seth.
Seth: Looking back, it came out in:That is some of the best visual effects I've ever seen for a movie between, like, Lord of the Rings coming out and the MCU really becoming, like, a big deal that held up very well. I didn't think that John Williams music was anything spectacular, but it still at least added the emotion necessary to the story to keep watching it.
I thought when there was action, it did really good. I loved the mix, the solid mix of practical set pieces along with the animation. So, yeah, I think all the way around, it's.
It's definitely a super duper.
Kyle:Love it.
Dustin:Super duper. I'm gonna go super duper. You know Mark, John Williams son. Mark is a friend of mine, so that's pretty. Pretty wild to have.
He likes my comedy or whatever, you know, hang out with him sometimes. But that's a crazy person. I'm just like, do you have any idea what your dad has done? It's crazy. The music that, you know, so good.
So I do love the music. I think they tried to do a new John Williams thing, but John Williams wasn't available. He was doing Jurassic park or something else.
I Don't know what was going on, but he didn't. So, yeah, I mean I always love that music. I think it's a great soundtrack. That first Superman, the music really holds it together in this.
It didn't work as well just because it's just you've heard it before and a lot of times music is that when you. For here for the first time, it more of an impact. So to put old music on a crappy new movie doesn't really work. Yeah. But it did look good.
I thought his flying was great. Like his flying. They finally got that down, you know, like it looks like he's flying. You know, it looks like he's really doing that stuff. Yeah.
Again, my favorite scene is that opening scene. I think that's beautifully shot shot that gives you so much. That scene really takes you in. Like you don't check out after that scene.
Like you're like, oh, this is gonna be amazing. And then it goes downhill. But you don't think that, you think it's gonna be. I mean that.
Because if you just watch that scene and like he was like, you know, and didn't know the rest of the movie sucked, you'd be like, I bet this is a great movie. So I think they do a good job with that. So it does look nice. You know, it's slick. I mean the guy knows what he's doing, knows his way around a lens.
So, you know, it's a good looking movie. Movie. So yeah, I'd say super duper with the way it looks and the production and you know, I like John Williams. So yeah, it's not bad.
Kyle:Boom. This is a squeak under for me because you almost convinced me to change. You almost got me to go super duper. But I can't quite commit.
Seth:Okay.
Kyle:But I will, I will say there are there. This isn't the worst CGI I've seen. It's not the worst visuals I've seen.
Seth:I've definitely seen shockingly holds up.
Kyle:It's pretty nice. It's pretty shiny. I don't like, like. Go ahead.
Dustin:No, I was gonna say for that time period. Definitely holds. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Kyle:I didn't love Superman's design. I definitely prefer the design of Snyder's bat or Superman a lot more.
Seth:I definitely look so bad.
Kyle:They do, they look bad.
Dustin:I just.
Kyle:Yeah, I don't like the trunks and there's. There's some good visuals here. But overall I, I'm not, you know, I'm not really compelled by the visuals, but it doesn't matter.
You guys won the category. But yeah, I would have gone, I would have gone Superman of it.
Seth:I do think the Fortress of Solitude was incredibly well done in this. Like, I, I, it looked super interesting and I liked how they had like the multiple ice chandeliers that had Jor El's face on them.
Like I thought, I thought that was especially really cool.
Dustin:Yeah, it had some nice moments visually.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:But it's not enough to carry it.
Seth:Yeah.
Kyle:Yep. All right. Too. It's getting tight here. We might, we might have a close one here. It is two to three. Yeah. Two categories left.
I call this category It's Raining Superman.
Dustin:Rain and Super Super Duper Barely Knower.
Kyle:Yeah. Just to call out a few of the, the past Supermans to compare.
So this is where we're gonna say, is this, is this a, is this a good Superman or a bad Superman? So we had Christopher Reeve, Ralph Cavill, and they even listed Nicholas Cage here, here.
Even though we didn't get it, I think it'd be fun to add just our projection. That's true.
Seth:Yeah.
Kyle:So, yeah, let's, let's put Cajun here. I wanted to see what the. Even just pretending like he had his own movie would have been like. And then.
Dustin:Movie. I didn't. That one, that one had some.
Seth:It was bad. It was horrible. You're not missing anything.
Dustin:Yeah. And the babies. You're like, oh, that was so bad.
Seth:That was the dumbest thing I have ever seen. Is that scene where he's picking up babies in the middle of the air. I'm like, what are we doing here? Here?
This is what we spent five years reshooting and recutting this movie to get. How dare you.
Dustin:Some people don't need a movie. I think the series is enough. You don't. You know, I don't know. The series is good, right? You guys like the series? I think it's decent. Right.
Seth:What I've seen, it's good. What I, what I know of Snyder's original plan for what the Flash movie was supposed to be, it would have been really cool.
Cuz he kind of wanted to use it to close off his version of the universe so that, that D.C. could move on and do whatever they wanted after that.
Dustin:Oh, I got you. Okay.
Seth:Yeah. But I don't think the way it.
Dustin:Turned out and Cage was in the movie. I didn't see that part.
Seth:Yeah, he pops in for literally like a four or five second cameo where you just play his version of what he would have been. Yeah.
Dustin:Oh, okay. That's exciting.
Seth:It was paying homage to what that movie would have been.
Dustin:Okay, I like that. Yeah, that's interesting.
Seth:But, yeah, if we're just talking about the. The film Superman, not the. Not the TV Superman, this especially does not hold up in any way, shape or form as.
As much as I wish I could say I loved Brandon Routh as Superman, I just don't think. I don't think the script was good enough for him. I don't think the direction was good enough for him. I think he tried too hard to be a.
A scrawnier version of Christopher Reeves than he should have. So this is going to be a super mad for me.
Kyle:Dusty. Justin.
Dustin:Yeah, I mean, it's just someone that, you know, is a little older than you guys that grew up. But the excitement of the first Superman and second Superman, I mean, it's definitely better than three and four, but that's not saying much.
I mean, we already. We already wrote two scripts today that's better than three and four, but. Yeah, it's just. Yeah. And it had a lot of potential.
Like, I saw it, like I said, I saw it in the theater. It was big and, you know, it was. It was exciting to have a new one, but it just fell short. And so, yeah, almost the same.
Seth:Especially with how good that opening scene was. Like, yes, the movie had held up to. That could have been great.
But I cannot imagine going into the theater and seeing that opening scene and then the rest of the movie. Like how.
Dustin:Well, this has happened to me on stage before where I use my closer too early and I can't follow it. Yeah, I'm like tanking, you know, where you're like tanking in the crowd and you just can't get them. And then you. And then you do.
Your clothes are like four minutes in, then you got nothing after that.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:You'Re doing crowd work. We got two minutes left away from. We're all from the same place. Stupid. Yeah. But. Yeah, I feel like, you know, that's it just.
Yeah, I mean, the first one was so exciting. Dude. Dude, it's just like. It's so exciting. The first Superman, the first Batman. And then like, you know, all the.
There's been so many after those times, so it just. Yeah, it sucks that it, you know, didn't. But whatever doesn't change anyone's life that it sucked. You know, whatever they tried change, you.
Seth:Know, changed Brandon Ralph's life pretty poor. Poorly.
Dustin:Yeah, but that's just him. He should have gone like independent acting, you know what I mean? He made enough Money. Make his own movies or something, right?
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Yeah. That guy reinvented himself. Like you have to do something. Yeah. I don't blame, you know, or the other kid from Twilight. You gotta. He made.
Now that guy's a great, cool actor. Like we. Yeah, I hated him when he was doing those movies. Now he's like a badass. He's. I think he's a good Batman. I. I don't know what that is.
Seth:Yeah, no, I thought he was reasonably good as Batman.
Dustin:Yeah. Like I said, Rudy, I mean, he's nailed that. Good lord.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Yep. You don't get rudier than him. Him. Yeah.
Kyle:Yeah. I hate this. This Superman. This is emo stalker Superman to me. The hair, everything about him. Head to toe. Worst, just worst attempt. I hate to be mean.
I just don't like Superman and I just. Ralph did nothing.
Seth:You don't hate to be mean. You're mean all the time on this podcast.
Kyle:Yeah, that's because I have insecurities.
Dustin:It's okay.
Kyle:Yeah. I'm also cute when I do it. I'm one of those cute, mean guys. But yeah. Yeah.
Dustin:My enemies.
Kyle:Yeah, but. But no, I like what you said earlier about the original Supermans.
Because even though I wasn't a huge fan of those, they were so woven into the culture and they were such a big deal. And Reeve really does. He's so. He's just in the zeitgeist. And he will always be the measuring stick. Because it was a big deal.
Those movies were just a big deal deal.
Dustin:They were.
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:It was. To bring lying around the corner. Big deal. That's movies. That's what those movies were. Star Wars, Superman lying around the corner, man.
Like you could sold out. You couldn't even get see these movies when they came out. Like, you had to like, ah, I gotta wait next week to see it. That's how big they were.
Movies aren't that big like that anymore. Yeah.
Kyle:And you take it for granted what it would have felt like to say, like, did you hear?
Seth:They're.
Kyle:They're gonna. They're gonna put Superman on the big screen. It's like, what.
Dustin:How.
Kyle:You know, it's like that was. It was that level of wonder.
Dustin:It's like.
Kyle:But he flies. Is he gonna fly?
Dustin:Like, what are they just.
Kyle:And I. It somehow to me is not ever surpassed any of that. And you talked about Gene Hackman earlier.
I know this is a Superman category, but, you know, there was just. There was just a level of. Of creativity and. And writing there that was so good. This Is just. This moves backwards for me. And.
And, you know, Cavill's better, but. Yeah. Reeves better. This doesn't. This just doesn't move the needle. So. Superman.
Dustin:Me. Yeah, me, me, me.
Kyle:One category left is 2 to 4. Doesn't matter at this point, but we're going to finish this baby out. How good are these bad guys, huh?
Seth:Lex Luther and his dog was a better bad guy.
Kyle:Yeah.
Dustin:Which one? The one that lived or the one that died?
Seth:The one that lived. The one that ate the other dog. Yeah, he's pretty.
Kyle:Lex Luthor. And like, what are these henchmen? Interns? Are these intern henchmen? I mean, who. Who are the. Are they the.
Dustin:I don't even remember the other people. I don't remember the other people in this movie. I remember nobody.
Seth:I only remember C pen because I'm familiar with him and other stuff.
Dustin:Yeah, I don't remember that dude at all. Like, that's a. I blanked. I'm blanked on whoever. This cow pin. No idea.
Seth:He was in house. He was in How I Met yout Mother. He's been in a bunch of random stuff kind of quick for a while.
Dustin:Main guy in house. No, no, no, no, no, no, no. The.
Seth:He was. He was one of the other doctors.
He left acting for a while to go be on Barack Obama's one the of his random teams that he was running while he was president.
Dustin:Okay. As we all.
Seth:Drone.
Kyle:Drone driver.
Dustin:Yeah.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:Is he a truck driver? Start a rumor.
Kyle:Yeah. Seth, what do you think, buddy?
Seth:Yeah, we're going to go. I think we're all going to go. Superman. This one. It's just as much again, as much as the supporting cast was better than the main cast.
If we're just talking bad guys, nobody other than. Than Parker Posey, like, nobody stood out. Out. And she wasn't even really a bad guy. She was just kind of there because she was Lex Luthor. Like, what.
What are we doing here? No one. No one stood out. There was nothing good to say about. Really? Anyone there? So, yeah, it's super met for me.
Kyle:What do you think, Dustin?
Dustin:Yeah, I don't know you guys. Have you guys been to Dollywood? Have you guys been.
Seth:I haven't actually. I need to.
Dustin:Dollywood's. Yeah. You guys. You guys. Yeah, you need to up your Tennessee game.
Seth:But I've been here 13 years.
Dustin:We'll go during Christmas. It's beautiful, fun. Dolly's a great time. But there's like a. You know, you walk in and it's got like all her wigs. Like, that's one of her.
Like, you know, like, you get a wall of wigs. And that's kind of what it reminded me in this.
In that movie when they, like, you know, like, sleepers wigs, like, they try to make it scary, and it's like, yeah, that's scary, dude. You're like, is he a transvestite? What's happening? Like, it just. Like, it just wasn't.
Like, they try to make the wig scene scary and like, oh, that's what was so about the first Superman. His. His wig's crooked. Like, it doesn't. He's not. It just. They don't make it like it's scary that he's got wigs. He's an evil man with his evil wigs.
You know, it was just so stupid how they tried to build it. Yeah.
Seth:At the very beginning, when he drops the wig with the little girl's hands and he's just like, you can have that.
Dustin:That's what I'm saying. They're trying to make the wigs. It's not like it's gremlins attacking the kid. You know, it's just like a stupid wig. It's just dumb.
All the things they tried to do was forced and not scary and not cool and not interesting and not, you know, evil in any way. I never once was scared of. Not that I was scared of Gene Hackman, but he's such a good actor.
I bought that he would take over and try to, you know, kill Superman. And, you know, I bought into the storyline of him and him frustrated, trying to take over everything. And I. I don't know, it just worked.
But with this. This less Lex Luthor or whatever, it just didn't. I don't know. I never bought it. And it always felt like it was empty. He felt very empty.
And I think villains are supposed to be full and rich. You know, you get that scene of, you know, Heath Ledger, you know, with. With the pencil and the thing. They're interrogating him.
Like, you know, you just need some moment that just makes you go, holy crap, this guy is crazy. And there's. There was none of that. There was no. Like, every villain should scare you a little bit. It should be something. And they never scared me.
It just seems stupid the whole time.
Seth:Yeah.
Dustin:So, yeah, Superman.
Seth:Couldn't agree more.
Kyle: when I moved to Nashville in:I was at Kroger at 1am to buy Ben and Jerry's ice cream because I was depressed, and some guy walked up to me with a white binder and asked me if I'd like to sell. What are those called? Energy drinks for him. And that's. That, to me, is who this Lex Luther is.
This is a Ponzi scheme energy drink pyramid scheme, selling. He's training these henchmen on his real estate Ponzi scheme to bring down Superman with the crystal Island. Like this.
The dumbest, least menacing plan ever. It just. Just. Just every literal thing about it. And then it's just Kevin Spacey. And it feels like Kevin Spacey.
They were probably afraid to give him notes, right? They were probably like, oh, it's Kevin Spacey. I don't want to tell him how to act. So that's.
Dustin:They were.
Kyle:I can just see them, like, sliding, like, paper under his door in his trailer, giving him notes and him just, like, tearing them in half and throwing away, like, those guys.
Seth:And then bring me some guys so I can Them.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle:Bring the boys.
Dustin:Yeah. I. I feel like there's just. Yeah. It's just never. Yeah. I don't know. Just never a moment where you just, like, feel, like, scared about this guy.
Like, they. They really could. Could have. Yeah. They could have done something interesting, you know, at least I think. You know what it is?
I think less is more with Kevin Spacy in a lot of ways, you know, and it's just like. At least with the movies, I mean, he was kind of funny in that once you didn't realize he was doing a Kevin Spacy.
The house of cards was kind of interesting, you know, But I do feel like usual suspects. He's in it just a little bit, you know? 7. He's in it just a little bit, you know, like, so you.
You know, he's able to kind of, like, do something interesting enough, but what. He's just, like, got such a major role as the opposite of Superman. It's not. It's just not interesting enough. It doesn't work.
Kyle:Chewing up the scenery.
Dustin:Yeah. It's just not. It doesn't work.
Kyle:Yeah. Two to five. We ripped this baby to shreds, and rightfully so.
Dustin:Boom.
Kyle:Two to five. I mean, I think. I think that's a good score, right?
Seth:I think it's. I think it's appropriate.
Dustin:Yeah. Can I ask a question? Has any. Has anything else had a two to five, five that you guys done?
Seth:We've had some zeros before.
Dustin:Zero. What was zero? What was zero?
Seth:The crow. City of Angels.
Kyle:Yeah. Two of the movies.
Dustin:Was that the second one? Not the first one. The second one.
Seth:No, not the first one. I think that was this the third one.
Kyle:Second.
Dustin:Oh, yeah.
Seth:Second. Okay. That one was bad. Salvation was bad.
Kyle:And Wicked Prayer.
Seth:Wicked Prayer was the worst. Oh my God, that one was terrible.
Dustin:Yeah.
Kyle: to. To join together to sync: Seth:Wife agrees with me. So I'm right.
Kyle:Yeah. So. But man, Dustin, this was. Go ahead.
Dustin:How do you guys feel about the new one coming out? I mean, I do like the idea of it's crypto. Is that the dog or something?
Seth:Yeah. I'm not excited about it, but I. Everything I've seen, set pictures, the previews, the animation all looks really cheap.
The, the, the fact that they're going to be fixing the costume in post because the costume was very ill fitting was literally like the colors were bleeding onto his skin. Like it was so poorly put together. I'm just, I have very low expectations, but I'm fully ready for James Gunn to blow my mind.
Dustin:Yeah, we'll see.
Kyle:Yeah, I won't see it until I absolutely have to, man.
Seth:Until I make him watch it for a podcast.
Kyle:Yeah, it's a form of torture.
Dustin:I do like a fly. A flying dog at least is the opposite of returns. That dog. Nobody better eat that dog, I'll tell you that. Yeah.
Kyle:Well, dude, Dusty was so great to have you on. You crushed it, man. Now you were, you were in it having a blast, man.
Dustin:This is fun.
Kyle:Oh, man. No, you're great. Tell the people where and when they can see you, man.
Dustin:Yeah, just follow me on Instagram. That's the only one that I know what I'm doing with.
You know, I'm trying tick tock, you know, I mean, you try to make the thing, you're like, what am I doing? You know? So follow me on Instagram at Dustin Underscore Chafin. I have some dates on there there. I'll be floating around the Bahamas and Mexico.
I don't know where I'm going. I'm just going to be on boats. I'm a Royal Caribbean.
If you guys, you know, want to make a last minute cruise and see some comedy, I'll be on those July through August and a whole bunch of dates and also be with Nate Brazzi. We'll be back on tour and doing some stuff in August. Oklahoma City in Dallas and some other dates in Maryland and stuff. So check that out.
And yeah, I'm around. Around. I'll be doing stuff.
Kyle:Hell, yeah. One of the funniest dudes out there doing it. Go check out his dry bar special. He's got that on his Instagram as well.
Thanks again for joining us, dude. I'm Kyle.
Seth:I'm Seth.
Kyle:And you are? Dustin. Love y'.
Dustin:All.
Kyle:Bye.
Seth:I was waiting for it.
Dustin:Movie wars it.
